Do you ever resist seeing yourSelf in your best and true light? Do you tend to focus on what's missing or feeling into where you aren't enough? We can call this 'imposter syndrome.' Many talented and successful individuals suffer this syndrome. For me it's like looking into a circus mirror. A distorted view of what is. It's a complete surprise when someone rolls up a real mirror and I see reflected back a different, not distorted image. This episode begins to work through the process of seeing what's in the less distorted mirror.
Listen to the excrutiating resistance of this client met by the gentle 'being with' and encouraging opportunity to take a small step forward out of that resistance that our coach offers. Coaching brings you back to yourSelf. It can look a million different ways. And it's a process.
If you would like to sample coaching for yourSelf, CONTACT US.
If you'd like to share what listening was like for you, DROP A LINE. We'd love to hear you!
Follow us on Instagram.
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#thecoachingconfidentialpodcast #coaching #podcast
Do you ever resist seeing yourSelf in your best and true light? Do you tend to focus on what's missing or feeling into where you aren't enough? We can call this 'imposter syndrome.' Many talented and successful individuals suffer this syndrome. For me it's like looking into a circus mirror. A distorted view of what is. It's a complete surprise when someone rolls up a real mirror and I see reflected back a different, not distorted image. This episode begins to work through the process of seeing what's in the less distorted mirror.
Listen to the excrutiating resistance of this client met by the gentle 'being with' and encouraging opportunity to take a small step forward out of that resistance that our coach offers. Coaching brings you back to yourSelf. It can look a million different ways. And it's a process.
If you would like to sample coaching for yourSelf, CONTACT US.
If you'd like to share what listening was like for you, DROP A LINE. We'd love to hear you!
Follow us on Instagram.
Follow us on Facebook.
Follow us on LinkedIn.
#thecoachingconfidentialpodcast #coaching #podcast
Vimla | 00:04
Welcome to episode four of the Coaching Confidential Podcast, the podcast that brings you behind the curtain of real life unscripted coaching conversations. We allow you to be a fly on the wall listening in to what others are exploring. You'll hear what's true for the clients as it is happening, and you'll experience what powerful coaching can be like from the perspective of the client and the coach in our post game. If this is your first time listening, we invite you to relax and notice what comes alive for you as you listen. We are your hosts, Vimla and Lisa D and we are thrilled that you're here.
Lisa | 00:44
In this episode, Vimla coaches me. Together, we explore the aftermath of me completing a long held goal that's obtaining my official coaching credential. After 13 years of making a living as a coach, this topic has been super charged for me across the years for a lot of reasons. Mostly, I've ignored the topic. However, last year I set my mind to earning the credential, even though I had complex feelings about it. It's only now that I've been awarded the credential that I'm beginning to unpack what this was all about for me. So this session outlines the start of that slow unpacking.
Vimla | 01:33
Lisa, do I have permission to coach
Lisa | 01:35
You? Yes, you do.
Vimla | 01:37
Last time we spoke, you said you have, um, coaching topic.
Lisa | 01:43
That topic was very alive when I brought it up, and it's still there. Like there's still something to discover. Let me just share for a second what it is and we can decide whether we wanna look at it.
Vimla | 01:57
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>.
Lisa | 01:58
So, yeah, the topic was about my credentialing. Mm.
Lisa | 02:03
You know, I had a lot of coaching to get me to the point where I earned the credential, where I did the things necessary to get the credential. But it's interesting, as I completed the process, it, particularly the final stages of the process, I, I got the sense that there's interesting material about myself contained within <laugh>. And I, I kind of wanna get clear on some of it. I mean, I, I feel it, I feel the energy of it. I guess I feel it as a thing. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you know, um, it was very like next to me, <laugh> as I was completing the test, getting my results, and then ultimately receiving the credential, like sooner than I thought it was gonna come. Uh, I felt like there was this thing there, but I'm not like, kind of clear what it is. Although I feel a little bit like it's a, a box with some stuff in it. <laugh>. It's really about exploring that, that I feel like is an as a opportunity.
Vimla | 03:29
Great. Do you wanna explore it today?
Lisa | 03:37
Yeah. Uh, you know, sure. Yes. The answer is yes.
Vimla | 03:42
Awesome. All right. So what are we exploring?
Lisa | 03:46
Yeah, so I guess let's just start with where I'm at. I'm very much in touch with the image of this container next to me alongside the journey. It's like, I feel, um, if I were to create a, you know, how metaphorical I can be, you know, it's like there's this box with a bow on it. Like it's a gift. Like it's a thing that's happening that is inviting me to open it and say like, okay, here's a thing. Here's some things to know about yourself. And, um, I have a little bit of hesitancy to open it.
Vimla | 04:35
If you want to name the box, what would you call it?
Lisa | 04:40
<laugh>. It's funny, this word just came to mind and it came to me in Italian <laugh>. So Placea, so placea is surprise in English, so please, uh, yeah, I would name the box. Surprise.
Vimla | 05:03
Mm. So it's a surprise box and it's a gift. Those are the two things we know about the box.
Lisa | 05:11
Yeah.
Vimla | 05:14
How big is the box? <affirmative>?
Lisa | 05:18
It started out, in my mind, small, but just when you asked me, it got bigger
<laugh>
Vimla | 05:23
How big is it now?
Lisa | 05:27
It's bigger than me.
Vimla | 05:29
Wow.
Lisa | 05:31
<laugh>
Vimla | 05:32
Are you ready to open it?
Lisa | 05:38
No. It's like, I'm just walking around it, looking at it. It's so interesting. Like, okay. So I think I mentioned that I feel like there's this package and that I feel hesitant to explore it, but you asked if I wanna explore it with you. And the minute that we started exploring it, I felt more comfortable with it. But then when you asked me if I wanna open it, I'm, I'm still not ready. So I'm not that comfortable.
Vimla | 06:11
<laugh> <laugh>. All right. So let's not open it. Yeah. So you said walking around it, looking at it, what do you see?
Lisa | 06:22
Well, it's pretty, it's like a, it's a nice sturdy box, but it's adorned with this beautiful bow, and I'm noticing I'm suspicious of it.
Vimla | 06:35
Mm. Interesting. What color is it?
Lisa | 06:39
Gold.
Vimla | 06:41
The whole box is gold.
Lisa | 06:43
Yeah. It's, well, you know what I, the image is like the gift emoji, um, on, on the iPhone, you know, gold with a red ribbon.
Vimla | 06:52
Yeah. And it's bigger than you.
Lisa | 06:55
And it's bigger than me. And I'm just kinda walking around it and I'm like looking up at it cuz it's way taller than me, but it's like super close to me. Like, it's like touching my skin.
Vimla | 07:12
Yeah.
Lisa | 07:12
You know, it's not far from me. It's, it's almost like, yeah. It's a part of me.
Vimla | 07:20
So you're not ready to open it yet?
Lisa | 07:25
I don't know. I think I'm trying to get comfortable with it is what's happening here.
Vimla | 07:29
Okay. Alright. So how do you wanna get comfortable?
Lisa | 07:36
Well, for now I'm kind of, it's sort of like a, a Christmas, you know, you've got the gifts under the tree and so you're kind of like trying to guess what could it be? Is it something I want or is it socks? <laugh>, you know,
Vimla | 07:54
<laugh>. All right. So let, let's explore the first option. Is it something that you want? So what would you want if it was something that you want?
Lisa | 08:08
Something that's easy to receive.
Vimla | 08:11
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Lisa | 08:15
Uh, something I didn't know I needed. Even if the need was just to receive it. In other words, like there's a, an awareness that sometimes we get a thing that we already have, but it wasn't until we got it that we realized or we remembered that we had it.
Vimla | 08:49
Yes.
Lisa | 08:52
So it's almost like, almost like, okay, I'm like, I'm speaking in deep metaphor here, <laugh>. But, um, it's almost like somebody gives you a mirror.
Vimla | 09:05
Mm. Yeah.
Lisa | 09:07
Right? And so I feel like what's in the box is something like that. And the metaphor I was actually using is like, okay, I have a thing. I don't know, it's a, it's place mats mm-hmm. <affirmative> for the table. Right. And I already have three of them.
Vimla | 09:32
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Lisa | 09:33
But in the box is the fourth.
Vimla | 09:36
Yeah.
Lisa | 09:37
So you're like, oh my God, I already have this exact same placemat, but I only had three, now I have four. Now I can actually put them on the table. <laugh>.
Vimla | 09:49
Yes. Yes. It's almost like it's a complimentary gift.
Lisa | 09:55
The missing piece.
Vimla | 09:58
Yes. So, so far what we know about the boxes, it's huge. It's gold, it has a red ribbon, it's touching you, it's very close to you. It's a surprise and it's a gift. And you hope that it's the missing piece.
Lisa | 10:17
Yeah. That's the, that's the real magic right there. Yeah. That it, it's, it completes something important.
Vimla | 10:28
Yes
Lisa | 10:29
Or necessary.
Vimla | 10:30
Yes. Yes. So what is the missing piece without opening the thes?
Lisa | 10:45
Yeah. I'm gonna come back to the mirror, right. The, the mirror. Cuz the mirror is like not the circus mirror. I have plenty of those <laugh>. Um, this mirror is like a really clear, accurate mirror. It's a representation of what is, um, and what always has been. And if I begin to like draw lines between that and my awareness of this box being present, um, which started like last week when I was taking the, the knowledge exam and particularly when I got the results
Vimla | 11:37
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Lisa | 11:40
It's like, yeah. There was this sense of surprise, you know, um, surprise that
Lisa | 11:52
This was easy to do. Yeah. Surprised that in fact, I already knew everything. Cause even when I got the email, I've been waiting for this email that would invite me to take this exam for a very long time, <laugh>. And when I got it, I thought, okay, now I can start preparing <laugh>. I was like, wait, no <laugh>, no. Like what if you already know everything there is to know to take this test? What if you're already prepared? Like, you know? And so the, I caught myself in this belief that I'm not prepared this belief of not enough. I haven't prepared enough and my knowledge is not enough. I am not enough.
Vimla | 12:51
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Lisa | 12:53
Which is not originally mine.
Vimla | 13:01
Yeah. So it seems to me like the surprise or the missing piece is the knowledge that you are enough that you know everything you need to know.
Lisa | 13:20
Yes, it is. As you say it back to me, as you reflect back to me, like I'm like, I'm comfortable hearing it. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it's almost like, and you probably notice this when I started talking about the, I'm not enough belief, even though I'm like, it's not mine. I'm much more comfortable talking about that than I am talking about the fact that in fact I am.
Vimla | 13:47
Yes. Yes. So I want to hear it in your words, what is the missing piece that could be in this box?
Lisa | 13:56
Yeah. So let me work there because I just, I think there's a piece that I, I wanna give voice to that I just, I just gave voice to. I wanna like, I wanna honor it, right? Like, I wanna honor the fact that there's a part of me that's uncomfortable believing that
Vimla | 14:19
Yes.
Lisa | 14:20
And embodying that I already know that I'm enough, that I am enough and that I already know whatever it is that makes me that <laugh>. So, you know, I don't need to force myself into being comfortable with that. I will become comfortable with that. I don't need to like, suck it up Buttercup my way there. <laugh>
Vimla | 14:49
For a moment. Just let's pretend that you are comfortable
Lisa | 14:57
Okay.
Vimla | 14:58
With this dis with this discomfort. We are just pretending.
Lisa | 15:02
Okay.
Vimla | 15:03
So in your own words, what is the missing piece that potentially could be in this gift?
Lisa | 15:11
Well, the missing piece is accepting the gift and being gracious about it and saying, thank you <laugh>.
Vimla | 15:22
Yes. And what is the gift?
Lisa | 15:26
Well, the gift is in fact that I am enough them. I know you want me to say it? Yes. <laugh>. And I can say it all day long. It's like the gift is embodying it.
Vimla | 15:38
Yes.
Lisa | 15:40
The gift is, is what I just said. It's receiving it gracefully. But the, for the sake of the gift is for the sake of something else. Yes. Right. So there's like, it's a process, I guess is what I'm trying to say.
Vimla | 15:54
Yes.
Lisa | 15:55
It's really nice to get that fourth place mat, you know, it could be for the sake of just having the place mats on the table cuz it looks nice and like they're out of the drawer and everybody gets to look at them now. But there's also the, for the sake of that's like, oh, and I get to like use them when I have people for dinner. Right. And other people get to experience this.
Vimla | 16:21
Yes.
Lisa | 16:23
And then, you know, maybe fast forward into the future, maybe it's for the sake of I'm done with the place mats one day Yes. And I get to give them to somebody else who really loves them.
Vimla | 16:34
Yes. Lisa, I'm gonna bring us back if that's okay.
Lisa | 16:42
Where are you bringing us back to
Vimla | 16:44
Pretending to accept this gift? Let's embody it. It's just pretend accepting it. It's like you're in the, in a drama performance. Your role is to accept just for playing. Let's play with it.
Lisa | 17:09
I am experiencing a humongous amount of resistance <laugh>, I'm like, uh, but play is
Vimla | 17:19
<laugh>.
Lisa | 17:20
It's, I get, I get what you're doing and I, let's see how far we can go with it.
Vimla | 17:32
Yes. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you for playing
Lisa | 17:35
<laugh>. <laugh>.
Vimla | 17:39
Yes. So, um, let's assume this was a play, a drama and, uh, there is a gift and somebody's receiving the gift. How would they receive it? Would they be standing, sitting? Would their arms be wide open? Would they be ready to embrace it? Hug it
Lisa | 18:01
In the play date? Yes. Yeah. In the play date. You know, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go back to like the gifts under the Christmas tree. I would jump up from my chair and be like, hell, hallelujah. <laugh> like, how did you know?
Vimla | 18:28
Yes.
Lisa | 18:29
Thank you so much. You know, this is the best gift ever. Yes. You know, it was like, I just got the Barbie doll of the season.
Vimla | 18:40
<laugh>. Yes. Let's do it. Let's jump off of, uh, chairs. <laugh>,
Lisa | 18:51
I would like you to read back to me what it is that you're receiving from me right now.
Vimla | 18:56
<laugh>, that you want to accept this gift. You, you are excited about this gift.
Lisa | 19:03
No, that's not what you're saying. That's what I'm, you, I'm giving you the, are you kidding me? No, I'm, but I'm gonna meet you halfway because, um, because that's progress. Halfway is progress.
Vimla | 19:26
Yes, it is. Okay. So what is that halfway point?
Lisa | 19:30
Halfway is like
Vimla | 19:34
<laugh>. Yeah.
Lisa | 19:35
And it's me like, not getting out of my seat, but raising my arms and in the way I would if I were jumping up and down like a kid. Right. It's mebo like moving my body. Not all the way. Actually my seat really bounces. So <laugh> and there's a voice in my head that's like, cut it out, <laugh> like pushing that over here. And I'm continuing to bounce
Vimla | 20:10
<laugh>. Yeah. And I'm bouncing with you.
Lisa | 20:15
<laugh>.
Vimla | 20:17
This is fun.
Lisa | 20:19
Yeah. This is as far as it goes right now. Yes. But it's, it's farther than where I was. And it's not all the way to where you were inviting me.
Vimla | 20:28
Yes. <laugh>. All right, so let's come back and, um, what's here now in this space?
Lisa | 20:39
It's the both and both and is here and what that means in Plano English language is I a couple feet forward into the embodiment of the gift and I'm aware of the voice of the critical voice that's saying. Yeah, no, no, no, no. None of that for you. So I'm just trying to keep it back here, so I'm ahead. Yeah. I've stepped out away, I'm moving <laugh>, and yet I am aware of that limitation, but really trying to stay separate from it.
Vimla | 21:25
Yes. I see you're sitting taller.
Lisa | 21:29
Yeah.
Vimla | 21:29
Your body has grown slightly. What would you like to do with this gift? For now, for this moment,
Lisa | 21:37
I would like to keep it close to me.
Vimla | 21:41
Mm-hmm.
Lisa | 21:42
<affirmative> sort of like the kind of gift that, that's like a box of chocolates, <laugh>, you know, you open it up and you take one out, you sneak it out.
Vimla | 21:55
Yeah.
Lisa | 21:56
And you take a little bite of it and you're like savoring it. Yes. You know? Yeah. There's a limited number of chocolates in there and you're gonna make 'em last <laugh>. Um, and not in a stingy way, although I do realize that there is a little bit of that energy there. I don't really wanna entertain that energy. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I want to entertain the abundant energy of like, what's in there is so good that I am only going to have as much as I can enjoy in any given moment.
Vimla | 22:33
Yeah. You have this box, you know what's in this box and you are ready to enjoy it a little bit at a time. And you don't want to open the box
Lisa | 22:46
That last, I don't wanna open the box like I am. I'm peeking in. I I think that I have opened the box I've peeked in, you know, and in the metaphor is like, I, I'm afraid of the impact of the sugar high if I take too much from the box <laugh>. So I'm just like nibbling. Right. And at some point I might be like, forget about it. I, I'm, I'm willing to throw a caution to the wind and have a sugar high. But right now I'm, I'm just sampling.
Vimla | 23:17
That's amazing.
Lisa | 23:19
And you've invited me to sample with my <laugh> bouncing celebration in my chair.
Vimla | 23:26
Yes. Yes. This is a good place to stop for today.
Lisa | 23:33
Yeah. Actually, can I say one more thing? Yeah. Because I wanna make it real on another level. So there's something I realized in the process of taking the exam and getting the credential and I have a sense of what it is and I wanna receive all that. It is, but I'm only prepared to do it a little bit at a time
Vimla | 24:04
Mm-hmm.
Lisa | 24:05
<affirmative>. And so we just, you helped me open the box, peek in, receive a little bit of what it is, which is basically myself, <laugh>
Vimla | 24:15
Yeah.
Lisa | 24:16
Like an accurate image of myself. And I'll take more when I'm hungry for it.
Vimla | 24:27
That's amazing. That's awesome.
Lisa | 24:33
So thank you. Now we can stop
Vimla | 24:36
<laugh>. <laugh>. All right. What are you making a commitment to?
Lisa | 24:45
I'm committing to savoring the bite that I took this morning with you and digesting it well or watching it digest, watching how it digests. And I think the commitment will be that when I'm hungry again to not starve myself.
Vimla | 25:02
Awesome.
Lisa | 25:03
Ah, more amazing metaphor. Incoming <laugh> to not starve myself of an accurate reflection.
Vimla | 25:11
Yes.
Lisa | 25:12
And to go back and to, to take another bite, maybe a bigger one this time.
Vimla | 25:17
I love it. So I heard commitment to not starving yourself. Commitment to savoring yourself. Enjoying the gift.
Lisa | 25:29
Yeah.
Vimla | 25:30
All right, let's end here for today.
Lisa | 25:34
Okay.
Lisa | 25:37
And now onto our post game. So Vimla, I'm curious what's present for you as the coach?
Vimla | 25:46
I'm feeling so much relief and um, I'm guessing that not all of this feeling is mine, but uh, I am experiencing relief.
Lisa | 26:02
What are you relieved about?
Vimla | 26:05
I guess my biggest relief is you're not going to starve yourself <laugh>. It's, um, it seems to be important in my head space. I don't know why it's important, but it seems like maybe it's important to you that makes it important to me in this moment.
Lisa | 26:28
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Vimla | 26:30
That's the relief. That's the biggest relief I'm experiencing that.
Lisa | 26:34
Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. Because as the client, what's present for me is a very palpable sense of something that is invisible that we're making visible.
Vimla | 26:49
Yes.
Lisa | 26:50
That is really important. It feels like this giant Harry Potter key. You know, it's like a Harry Potter character carrying a key that's so big and they're putting it in this door and turning it Right. It seems like a really important thing. So I'm feeling it through like this vibration in my body, in my physical body. But it's powerful enough that you are feeling it over there.
Vimla | 27:24
Yes.
Lisa | 27:27
So what's present is we're both feeling the significance of the topic. Anything else?
Vimla | 27:36
I had to manage myself because I have that desire that oh, let's open that gift and accept it and it's beautiful. It's for you and it will look so beautiful on you. I had to respect that my client is not ready and that's okay.
Lisa | 27:59
Yeah. So I understand that I was the client, but I'm just gonna riff with you as the coach right now. It sounds like what you're talking about are some coaching skills. Yes. One of them was intuition. Yes. That there's something important here and that comes maybe from previous history coaching together, but it also, it's available to any coach in any session at any time. Yes. Um, it's, it's a skill that gets applied. Yeah.
Vimla | 28:42
Yes.
Lisa | 28:44
And that you paired that with the skill of self management of staying with me and my agenda and where I could go and be and not where you might see me capable of going.
Vimla | 29:01
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. In this session there was one more place where I leaned into my intuition and directing my client a little bit, directing you Lisa, without permission. But I was waiting and I was ready If you said no, we would not go there. And that was the place where you went into talking about what is it for the sake of, instead of opening the gift or embodying the gift. And I said, yes, that's important, but let's just first open the gift.
Lisa | 29:44
And as you look back on that moment in the session, do you remember what was going on inside you? Do you remember a conscious choice about that?
Vimla | 29:53
It was almost like my body shut down slightly. My body went like, what just happened? We had a gift here. This is exciting. Why are we going away from this gift? My body didn't have the energy, it had a little bit of energy leakage. I was also following my body, but of course I was completely ready. If you didn't want to go back, we would not have, like if you had resisted again or resisted a lot, we would not go there.
Lisa | 30:29
Yeah. I think it's really important to point out that that moment is possible because of the other competencies that have been built up in the coaching relationship. So
Vimla | 30:40
Yes,
Lisa | 30:41
Building trust is a coaching skill and there had been enough trust built up that you trusted that I could push back.
Vimla | 30:54
Yeah. And that was when I steered a little bit.
Lisa | 30:58
Yeah. And steered on the foundation of the trust that Yes. In the relationship. Yeah. And probably too on the coaching skill of intuition that you had.
Vimla | 31:11
Yes.
Lisa | 31:12
Well I guess I think of intuition as a, a head thing, but I guess it really is like a whole body thing. You were paying attention to what was happening with your body and following that.
Vimla | 31:22
Yes, absolutely. The whole body thing. And it's also the trust in the coaching process. You know, this process, you trust the process and because you are familiar with it, you are willing to experiment for a few minutes here and there, even if you are being steered in a place where you may not like to be.
Lisa | 31:46
Yeah. Yeah. That's a really good point that the trust happens at different levels of abstraction.
Vimla | 31:52
Yes.
Lisa | 31:53
And that moment may not have been possible with a client who was not necessarily trusting of the coaching process or hadn't built up a great deal of trust to the process.
Vimla | 32:05
Yes.
Lisa | 32:06
Yeah. They could have a great deal of trust in you, but maybe not the process and it wouldn't have the same impact.
Vimla | 32:13
Yeah, absolutely. So for example, if I was talking to a friend of mine and, uh, so we have great trust, but if I tell them, Hey, let's go this way, plus they need to understand it. They need to know what the process is because they're surprised. And then I have to explain the process to them. So we have to set it up, set up the context, and then they might be willing to go there.
Lisa | 32:39
Yeah.
Vimla | 32:40
So the coaching process also helps.
Lisa | 32:44
Yeah. Yep. We make agreements with clients.
Vimla | 32:50
Yes.
Lisa | 32:52
There are things that we both agree to. We practice a style of coaching called Coactive.
Vimla | 32:58
Yeah.
Lisa | 32:59
That's a hundred percent from the coach and a hundred percent from the client. And we make agreements about what those things are. And I think, at least in my sessions, we often come back and we enhance the agreements over time because I think the agreements that we make in the beginning, especially with clients who haven't been coached much in their life or new to coaching, they agree to things, but there isn't really a deep understanding of what they're agreeing to.
Vimla | 33:27
Yeah, absolutely.
Lisa | 33:30
So we come back and now that we have a clearer picture of what the thing is, we can create a more refined agreement. We know more deeply what we're agreeing to. And I think that when we do that, we bring more of our energy and you know, that's what helps the process do its thing.
Vimla | 33:56
Yes, absolutely. I have a client where I think that's what's happening. We have built a lot of trust but not trust in the coaching process. So the client is willing to go wherever I take them, but there is still a resistance to the process.
Lisa | 34:20
Yeah. It's sort of like coaching container is the third entity. Like let's say we were coaching in person and we're in a room together and the room is this ramshackle of a space and you can't really relax cuz you think the ceiling might cave in.
Vimla | 34:38
Mm-hmm. <affirmative> mm-hmm <affirmative>,
Lisa | 34:40
You don't feel safe in the space.
Vimla | 34:42
Yeah.
Lisa | 34:43
You can't trust the space and the coaching process is the space. So you were saying that you are aware that with one of your clients, there's a high degree of trust in the relationship between the coach and the client, but there's some reservations, oh, you didn't use those words. I'm gonna use that word
Vimla | 35:02
Yeah.
Lisa | 35:03
In the process. And so when, if ever does that become a thing?
Vimla | 35:14
So I know that there's no trust in the process when the wheels are spinning, when we keep going around the circle all the time, the topics are repeating themselves but not going anywhere. So the person is playing, coming into the sandbox to play, but not really playing.
Lisa | 35:37
And if you had to describe what was, what would be going on in the client, I know you're not in there, but if you've ever been in this position, maybe you've debriefed this with the client, like what's going on with them inside them? What are they experiencing?
Vimla | 35:54
I feel like their attention is not on themselves. Their attention is more on what is this trying to understand what is this like in coaching? We take our time to create the container, create the process, build the relationship, build the trust, and then all the attention is on the client or the client's topic. But this client in such an example, their attention is not on them. Even though I'm doing my best to put my attention on their topic.
Lisa | 36:33
Yeah.
Vimla | 36:33
They are not putting their attention on the topic. What's also showing up for me is that I need to follow their attention. Maybe that's one way to clarify the process for them. Build their trust in the process.
Lisa | 36:49
Yeah. It, it occurs to me as you say this, that this could really help reconnect the client, bring them back to themselves.
Vimla | 36:59
Yes.
Lisa | 37:01
Just doing that.
Vimla | 37:02
Yes. Absolutely.
Lisa | 37:04
It's so beautiful the way that you were talking about how clients have something going on or they don't, they're not trusting the process I was making up as you were saying that, that a client feels fearful now we can't know what a client feels unless they say it, unless we ask and then they say it, right?
Vimla | 37:23
Yes, absolutely. And it's such a beautiful definition of coaching, bringing the client back to themselves. That's what coaching does.
Lisa | 37:34
Yeah. I'm really feeling attached to this, um, beautiful definition of coaching that just emerged in this conversation. So I was the client, so I'll speak in the first person bringing me back to myself.
Vimla | 37:46
Hmm.
Lisa | 37:47
It's kind of a big deal for me to come back to myself and that's really what that whole coaching session was about.
Vimla | 37:57
Yeah. Wow. That was powerful. So listeners, we came back to the session after a few weeks and I asked Lisa how she was feeling about this session. No. Here's her response.
Lisa | 38:18
As Vimla and I have been editing this episode to publish that involves listening to the episode over and over again. And as I have been listening, I'm noticing the significance of this session for me. And I was incredibly uncomfortable in this session and I wasn't uncomfortable for any reason that had to do with the coaching itself. I was uncomfortable with what this process is asking me to do.
Vimla | 39:10
Lisa, if I may ask a question for clarity.
Lisa | 39:14
Sure.
Vimla | 39:16
You used the word what this process is asking me to do. What was it asking you to do?
Lisa | 39:23
Yeah, so through this coaching, I'm being asked to look inside myself and see the truth of what's there. And sometimes that can be overwhelming. That can be overwhelming. Even if what we're seeing we judge as positive or good. Sometimes we don't wanna look inside because we have a judgment that something's bad or negative. But I can't say enough about how even if the thing we're looking at is a gift, it can be hard to look at and to be with and to receive
Vimla | 40:16
What you're saying is so accurate. It's super hard to look inside.
Lisa | 40:24
We can look inside and see something that we or society may judge as abundant, good, positive and whatever labels that we wanna put to it and still feel really uncomfortable at the same time. And that's what was going on for me during the session. I, I was only able to go so far in being with that. And now that it's a couple of weeks later, I have an appreciation for a couple of things. One is, is that this kind of thing is our process. It is a process. Um, it isn't always something that we can absorb in one's sitting. So I really am trying to be patient with myself around this and really grateful for the coaching process that does actually support patients around that and like holds the whole thing beginning to end. So yeah, it is a process. Also, there is truth in small steps being really vital to processes. And so I guess I just wanna step back and say, even though I didn't go the whole way that I was being invited to go by you as the coach in the session, I took some step, I moved forward a little bit and I challenged myself to do that. I do recognize how much of my energy, my willingness and courage it took me to stay in the conversation and to meet you halfway to your invited destination <laugh> and, and how important it is to celebrate that.
Vimla | 42:39
Yes, absolutely. I love that. Yes. I'm so glad you said that. And you were very courageous. You started off the session saying, this is uncomfortable and I just want to explore. And, uh, we did go beyond just exploration and going towards what brings you discomfort is an act of courage. Thank you so much, Lisa. You've been very generous sharing your experience and Of course, very great.
Lisa | 43:17
All right. So we'll see you next time and the next session, please feel free to check out our site, dub dub dub, your vital self slash coaching confidential, and drop us a line.